Auntlee

PersianGirl · 06-03-2004, 11:27 PM

I have been reading everything that has been going on and I am very intrigued about what you have discovered.....some questions I have and anyone can answer is this.....I have been using saw palmetto and for me have not seen that much of an improvement....my Dr. wants to put me on BC's, either orthro-evra or Yasmin..I have both but have not decided which to take. I would like to avoid BC's at all possible....Auntlee...how soon after you started using your combo did you notice results. And the other thing I wanted to ask was are you dealing with cysts and what are you doing for that versus taking BC's? And the other thing...do you live in Austin and where in Austin are you getting your vitamins at..Whole Foods? I am up there every now and then and was curious as to where you got them...sorry to be a pest but it isn't everyday that you find a place that everybody has the SAME problem and can openly talk about it without FEELING like a FREAK!! Thanks and God Bless Everyone

PersianGirl · 06-03-2004, 11:28 PM

I thought this was going into the the Thread labeled "pimples and excess hair" ...sorry to have started this one my accident....Goofy Me:o

zlicius · 06-04-2004, 08:05 PM

HI! I'm in Houston also... I get all of my herbs from GNC, and my "concoction" of TCM from my acupuncturist.

HTH!

PersianGirl · 06-04-2004, 08:09 PM

I have never heard of this or maybe I have and I do not know what the abbreviations mean...please explain. And where do you go to get these herbs in Houston? Thanks

zlicius · 06-04-2004, 08:11 PM

Traditional Chinese Medicine=TCM

GNC is a store and I'm sure they're in a strip center near you or in the closest mall.

I get my herbs specifically made for me at http://www.easternharmonyclinic.com/ where I get my acupunture done. They are at HWY 59 & Montrose.

Auntlee · 06-08-2004, 01:34 PM

Hi -- sorry it's been a few days; I was on vacation.

I noticed improvement in the hirsutism within a month -- which was interesting, because I wasn't especially looking for improvement there; I was taking the mega-doses to try to conceive and to postpone menopause.

I get the vitamins various places -- Target and Central Market both carry 800 mcg folic acid pills -- 250 count for $2.75, which is as cheap as I've found. The time-release PABA that they carry at Whole Foods seems to work better than non-time-release PABA.

I really encourage people (who don't have the contra-indications -- see sig line) to try this regimen to see it if works for them -- if your body is deficient in folic acid, there will be other severe problems eventually as a result -- notably heart disease and possibly birth defects.

Apparently the body needs folic acid to metabolize estrogen -- this is probably why this therapy works. I just found some info on how this works -- I'll post it when I can.

I don't have cysts, so don't know about alternative treatments for them -- I believe other cysters have posted info on this.

PersianGirl · 06-08-2004, 04:46 PM

What's the brand name og your PABA....when I went to my Whole Foods they did not carry any kind of PABA that was the strength you were talking about.....I ended up ordering mine from a vitamin store online....not time-released but I hope it should still work...I bought the book by Dr. Atkins and the only thing I found that is frustrating abou it is that there SO MUCH information I jsut want to take EVERYTHING!!! But that can get VERY expensive!!!

Auntlee · 06-15-2004, 01:01 PM

Hi -- I believe the PABA brand is Country Life -- they usually have it at the Whole Foods on 6th, though they've been out of it before -- I usually buy two bottles when it's there.

After five months or so on this therapy, I feel that I'm 90% better -- most of my life, I woke up to a chin full of stubble, an hour's worth of plucking -- now I wake up to a chin that feels smooth, but when I look in my super-magnifying mirror there will be maybe two mean black hairs and maybe 20 weak hairs. I can also see that there are hairs under the skin that aren't up yet, but still way, way fewer than there used to be.

I'm still trying to figure out how to fix that last 10% -- would more folic acid or boron or PABA or acidolphilus do it? Or is there something additional that I haven't figured out yet? I did read that folic acid peaks in the bloodstream and then exits very quickly, so maybe taking that more often? I found one brand of time-release folic acid on the web -- in the UK -- haven't decided whether to try it yet.

I will say, tho, that I tried the powder form of the folic acid at beyond a century dot com, and it was cheap, but when I switched over to it completely, a lot of the hair came back, making me believe that there wasn't folic acid in the powder -- or maybe I got a defective bottle or something. There was an undeniable difference, which is a real pain because the price was great.

PersianGirl · 06-15-2004, 01:53 PM

I just started using the Folic Acid Powder form today....I pray that you had a defective bootle( not trying to be rude!) I already take at least 25 vitamins a day..I just could not bare to think of taking 60 more! I wonder...the folic acid you are taking...is it capsule or tablet...I wonder if you could just open the capsules and put the powder in a drink or even grind the tablets in a blender and put it in a drink?? I also was wondering..have you noticed a difference in your hair? I have been noticing my hair getting thinner and I was wondering if the Folic Acid might help it grow back

Auntlee · 06-23-2004, 12:54 PM

Well, hate to say more vitamins, but for hairgrowth Biotin helped me -- I had a minor receding hairline, and I noticed after starting the biotin for insulin resistance, there were hairs starting to grow in at the hairline.

I know it's a pain taking so many pills, but for me it's worth it -- I have an extremely limited window left in trying to conceive, and so I'm willing to take large amounts of stuff for the next six months or so, after which time I'll have to give up on TTC, tho I'll still take the folic acid for the hirsutism, as it's made my life so much easier.

Have you ever posted all your symptoms & meds? Try putting those in your sig line -- it helps when cysters are deciding on advice.

PersianGirl · 06-23-2004, 01:07 PM

what's a sig line??

SweetJade · 07-05-2004, 05:12 AM

Auntlee,
So glad you are posting now. After I read your threads over a month ago, I immediately did some research and ordered the Vita Nutrients book ($4 at Amazon) and found suppliers that sell bulk powder forms of these supps. To answer your concern about the BAC Folic Acid powder, it states that it is only 10% Folic Acid and the rest is TMG. Therefore, that 30g bottle only contains 3g of Folic Acid and is not going to help you at all.

Now from my research the only way you are going to safely prevent the effects of DHT is by Blocking the Androgen Receptor, by Binding DHT (Eqoul - soy isoflavone), or by using Anti-androgens. Guess what method yours is? Right, an anti-androgen.

Anti-Androgens prevent the activity of testosterone by binding it to Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (a marker for PCOS & IR). There's a few ways to boost SHBG, one of which is through Estrogen (or use of estrogen boosters, mimickers, or phytoestrogens) and the other is through Low Carbohydrate Type diets (some are better than others).

A way to eleviate your other 10% is probably by improving your insulin level stability (as high levels lower SHBG), thus lowering your testosterone levels, by stepping up your diet more, or taking supps or meds.

Meds - Avandia, Metaformin

Supps - N-Acetyl Cysteine (NAC), D-Chiro-Inositol,

Another posibility may be by adding Bee Propolis (estrogenic), or by using a DHT Blocker. A DHT Blocker or Androgen Receptor Blocker's job is to well look like androgen or DHT and bind to that site so that DHT can't. The best ones that don't alter our estrogen levels (as DHT Inhibitors do) are:

(Spironolactone or Cyproterone Acetate)

Beta Sitosterol - falls under the catagory of Saw Palmetto, Nettle, and Phytosterols. However those herbs are DHT Inhibitors, yet thankfully you can buy Beta-Sitosterol alone or within a plant sterol formula.

Curcumin - this is derived from Tumeric and can be found as 45% or 95% Curcumin extract.

EGCG - alone this is a blocker, but this falls under Green Tea catechins and as whole is a DHT Inhibitor, but has other health benefits.

Indol-3-Carbinol - the active component is really DIM, but that costs a ridiculous amount of money (at VGD USA), so hopefully our bodies are not defficient in converting I3C into in. Hmm..it is said that this also boosts estriol (good estrogen) and helps eliminate bad estrogen, but decreases testosterone's binding to SHBG...hmm. VGD USA sells I3C starting at $35.38 for 1g while BAC sells I3C 12g for $21 and 20g of DIM for $9.75 ....or we can eat more broccoli and other cruciferous veggies ;-)

For women prone to fibroids or afraid of estrogen induced cancer Curcumin enhances glucuronidation as does Calcium D-Glucarate . This aids in the elimination of toxins & hormones so they don't get recirculated, but more specifically estrogens (but hopefully it's the bad ones).

I ordered my supplies a few weeks ago, but I ended up getting a misadvertised Folic Acid powder from LEF.org, but it's ok for I've found a much more affordable supplier at http://www.vitaspace.com and it will be here this coming week so I can start!!!

These are the price qoutes Vitaspace gave me:

Calcium D-Glucarate, 50g - $30
Tumeric Extract 45% Curcumin, 1kg - $100
Tumeric Extract 95% Curcumin, 1kg - $130
Beta Sitosterol 40%, 1kg - $50
Boron Aspartate 5%, 1kg - $34.75
Boron Citrate 5%, 1kg - $33
Boron Chelate 5%, 1kg - $33.25
PABA, 1kg - $30
Folic Acid 10% Powder, 1kg - $40

The Boron & Folic Acid contain fillers due to the small amount needed. That Folic Acid will last over 4 years, but it is light sensitive so it may not remain active that long (can't beat that price) so I guess we should keep it out of the light ;-)

Since the Beta Sitosterol is only 40% (which is perfect), I emailed him to find out what the other 60% was and hopefully he'll let me know tomorrow.

These are additional suppliers:
http://www.Sciencelab.com
http://www.vgdusa.com
http://www.beyond-a-century.com (got my green tea and boron from them..they seem to also wholesale LEF.org products)

That's all I've got for now =)

SweetJade · 07-05-2004, 05:15 AM

Persian Girl,
See that blurb of information under the bar in our posts? That's a sig line =)

PersianGirl · 07-05-2004, 06:53 PM

I just a quick question about all this info that you have provided.....now I have been taking Saw Palmetto for two and half months and have started seeing a difference with my facial hair....the question I have is, is the Beta Sitosterol suppossed to be better than the Sw Palmetto. I went to the Health Fodd stor and asked the about this and they said it works the same way the Saw Palmetto does....now I am confused,,,,I want to use something that is going to help the facial hair and hair thinning problems the best...any advice?? Thanks

SweetJade · 07-06-2004, 06:38 PM

Persian Girl,
That's correct Saw Palmetto does contain the same active ingredient that will block Androgen Receptors from DHT, but to a lesser amount. However it has the additional advantage of working as a DHT inhibitor by reducing the amount of 5alpha reductase needed to convert T into DHT.

The fact that it acts as a DHT Inhibitor, is what concerns some women. They fear that because all DHT Inhibitors also reduce aromatase, that they will now have more Free Testosterone running around, because it isn't converting into Estrogen (that's what aromatase does). It shouldn't severely affect our estrogen levels, especially if you are taking BC or another form of natural estrogen (like the Mega Folic Acid Therapy).

Not to mention, Saw Palmetto is one of the most phytoestrogenic herbs (more so than Black Cohosh, and Don Quai), but it also has properties that help with cancer. So in this respect, I think it's nature's way of dealing with cancer because most common cancers involve Estradiol, IGF-1 and/or DHT. So Saw Palmetto reduces all of these and some women have noticed increased facial hair from using it while other women have noticed a decrease in facial hair and skin clarity.

I myself have taken large doses (1200mg - 1800mg) for several months at a time, with and without Spiro, and have never noticed a change in body hair or acne. It sounds like to me you are doing rather well. What dose are you taking and in what form? If you want to boost this you can add Beta-Sitosterol as studies have found this to be the active ingredient and is supposedly 1000x more potent. The body only absorbs 5% - 10% of Beta Sitosterol so you are looking at taking 300mg or more in capsule form.

HTH =)