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  1. #1
    Registered User Alison_o's Avatar
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    Default 180 degree health?

    Has anyone read, considered doing or done 180 Degrees Health metabolism raising program to help with PCOS?
    Alison, Thin Cyster, 36 - diagnosed 1990, no meds since 2007
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    Registered User Somewhat Damaged's Avatar
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    I've read some of Matt Stone's stuff.

    Some of his ideas are interesting, but I don't buy into many of them 100%
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    Registered User Alison_o's Avatar
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    Have you read about his temperature/metabolism raising plan? My friend has recently done it with good results and I read about it's relevance to PCOS here: http://www.naturallyknockedup.com/ra...y-temperature/
    Alison, Thin Cyster, 36 - diagnosed 1990, no meds since 2007
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    I did read his temperature/metabolism raising plan and I thought it was very interesting. I'm new to the subject but I noticed the article and found it very interesting as I am very intrigued by our body and how it works between men and woman. Another resource I would check out is http://www.osha.gov/ if you're interested in occupational safety or health administration as it gives tons of information on the field and new studies being done across the country. Also if you're interested in pursuing this field as a profession take a look at http://www.mhaprograms.org/ as it offers numerous programs that can help you break into the health industry and also teach you more things like the 180 degree health metabolism raising plan or other fun studies that have been done.

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    Mod of Diet and Exercise! Maddy's Avatar
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    I have used these tips. not from his work though - I have a booked "the body cure" and I use the metabolism reset periodically which is the same plan. I've found if I follow it for a short period it helps and i don't gain weight - any longer and i do though. It also works with other information i've researched on weight loss - i.e. carb recycling and intermittent fasting - i.e. using low calorie and carb periods with "refeeds" to lose weight but keep the metabolism from dipping.
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    Registered User August's Avatar
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    If I understand correctly . .(and I may not) Matt Stone seems to be into raising metabolism with carbs &/or overfeeding . . to me that seems like it might not be the right think for someone with PCOS . . . . Another interesting idea for raising metabolism is Dr Jack Kruse's CT (Cold Thermogenesis) Protocol . . . (Dr Kruse is kind of a controversial figure in the Paleo world . . but I am drawn to some of his ideas) please see http://jackkruse.com

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    Registered User flapjacks28's Avatar
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    I'm so glad this was brought up here! I happen to be on Matt's plan right now, and for anyone who wants it, here are the details:

    I started because I was doing terribly after stopping some of my supplements (they're expensive and, in the case of daily shakes, annoying), being prescribed wayy too many antibiotics for no good reason, and drinking too much. I tried the GAPS diet to reverse some of the many food allergies that resulted from all of the above. Unsurprisingly, though, my body temp dropped to 93.8 on that diet, which in my case was extremely low carb. So I decided to try 180DH, and I've now done it for a month and a half.

    Pros: Had two periods, on time, without the use of natural progesterone cream, with no pain or excessive bleeding. For basically the first time ever, without a Pill. Before that point, I would just bleed continuously throughout the month. Also, my temps are up to around 98.5-99.5 on average. My skin is also softer.

    Cons: 35lb weight gain. Yep. 35lb. Even Matt was shocked. This was on a whole foods version of his overfeeding plan, btw. Also sluggish, have joint pain, tired and sick all the time...

    Conclusion: I have to agree with Maddy here. Carb cycling is probably a really good idea, to keep my temps up but not make me go into IR shock. It's too early to tell, obviously, but my plan henceforth is to go back to Paleo with carb cycling, and hopefully exercise with higher temps will work better.

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    Registered User Ali1987's Avatar
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    Is something like this good for someone who needs to lose a lot of weight? Say around 50 pounds or more? It seems very interesting!
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  10. #9
    Registered User Alison_o's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flapjacks28 View Post
    Cons: 35lb weight gain. Yep. 35lb. Even Matt was shocked.
    That is some serious weight gain! The weight gain is part of the reason I was put off, as I spent my adolescence obese - I've lost 140lbs - and I don't want to go back there! Also I don't fancy feeling terrible...

    Why did you start with Matt's program - was it specifically beacause of basal temperature?

    Also interested to talk about your plans going forward - are you stopping the overfeeding now? How often are you going to carb cycle? And do you plan to exercise to try and maintain your body temperature?
    Alison, Thin Cyster, 36 - diagnosed 1990, no meds since 2007
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    Registered User Alison_o's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    I have a booked "the body cure" and I use the metabolism reset periodically .
    Is this a book? I've had a look for references to it without success.
    Alison, Thin Cyster, 36 - diagnosed 1990, no meds since 2007
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    Mod of Diet and Exercise! Maddy's Avatar
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    sorry - when I was typing I couldn't quite remember the name - it's The Diet Cure
    I finally have healthy ovaries free of cysts!
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  14. #12
    Registered User flapjacks28's Avatar
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    Hey Alison.

    Yeah, it's some serious weight gain and I'm not altogether surprised. Since a bout of early childhood depression (which I suspect brought on IR, among other factors), I've never had good carb tolerance. This doesn't fit with Matt's idea that IR is caused by "carb restriction" or "excessive dieting" or "starving yourself." It's just the way I am, and it doesn't matter what the source of the carb is.

    If you did want to try it, I would say it's a last resort. You'll almost definitely feel terrible. If your symptoms are under control and you're feeling happy and not overly restricted by diet, I can't see any reason it'd be necessary.

    I started the program because I was failing at everything else. You have to understand that when I started Paleo and supplements and weightlifting, everything was grand. I was pretty sure that I'd never have to deal with PCOS symptoms again. But then they resurfaced. I couldn't eat literally anything without feeling miserable, my period was a mess, my hair loss and depression accelerated... I had just had enough. The low body temps just sealed the deal, and nicely confirmed that something was very, very wrong. I also read up on Wilson's Temperature Syndrome, which seems to suggest that no matter what I try with temps that low, I can't heal. It makes sense: You need a good cellular metabolic rate in order to grow healthy new cells and repair sick or malfunctioning ones.

    Yes, I'm gradually coming off overfeeding now. I'm starting with a low cab breakfast, but then keeping carbs up the rest of the day. This has been shown to encourage metabolic flexibility more than a high carb breakfast would. And then I'm going to steadily cut them out until I'm at the equivalent of one serving of carbs (sorry, I don't count/measure anything), while still maintaining body temps. Fruit and veg won't count, and I will keep those up pretty high. The author of the Body Ecology Diet had good things to say about going low carb on her blog, and how we should do it very gradually (keeping in "grain-like seeds" like buckwheat and amaranth indefinitely) to avoid side effects like food intolerences and lowered body temps.

    I really have no idea how I'll carb cycle yet, it'll depend on weight gain, sugar cravings and my body temps. I'll start with a couple days of it every two weeks or so, and hopefully that'll be enough. If I crave them, I will eat them. If not, I'll try something different. And no, I will exercise to maintain my weight and strength, but I suspect exercise lowers body temps in the long run. However, I did read in WTS that exercising with a high body temp is much more likely to be successful, and that's probably true. The exception is yoga: it helped me lose the most weight initially, even without cardio versions of it. Probably because it can dramatically lower cortisol, so I would suspect it doesn't lower body temperature.

    Hope this helps! Were you thinking of starting Matt's plan or just curious?

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    Registered User Alison_o's Avatar
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    Thank you very much for this honest and informative response. It's good to hear from someone who's thought this through and engaged with it.

    I followed your prompts to Wilson's and BED - both interesting. BED I've heard of before (I love fermenting) but Wilson's I hadn't.

    I came across Matt's plan through a friend who has low temps and used it successfully to raise hers. My only PCOS issue is that I don't have a cycle at all - and haven't had one for nearly 5 years now (they've always been pretty scarce without BCP, but looking back I think the trigger for this latest stoppage was going vegan - I'm not vegan or vege any more). I've always been so cold and taking my temps confirmed that I was low. Matt's writing makes sense and I was drawn to it as a way of finally dealing with the fact that I'm cold all the time, but also bringing back my cycle. I have read his books, but the potential weight gain has really put me off - being obese up till 21 really left me with some scars...I've maintained a 140lb weight loss (perhaps a cause of my borderline IR in the first place?) and really don't want to put on weight again.

    I've read a lot about Paleo as well, how people get good inital results, but it's not sustainable. I'm kinda fed up of diets (having 'done' vegan, and lots of incarnations of raw vegan over the last 3 years) and just want a balance that'll work for me...but I am keen to improve my temps and want my cycle back!

    I wonder whether the low carb principles of BED would provide some temperature improvement, or whether refeeding is necessary to jump start the basal temperature?

    Love to have your thoughts.
    Alison, Thin Cyster, 36 - diagnosed 1990, no meds since 2007
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    Registered User flapjacks28's Avatar
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    I love fermenting too! And collecting too many fermenting jars...

    I really wish I could provide you with more useful information, but to be honest I'm new to body temp malfunction and haven't done too much research on it. From my experience coming off Matt's plan, however, it seems that lots of sleep and eating frequently (no matter what I eat) keep my temps up much better than eating massive amounts of every macronutrient, without the nasty side effects. It's possible that I simply wasn't eating enough before (low temps can kill your appetite and vice-versa), or relaxing/sleeping enough to keep my cortisol down. If you're keen to try it, I would say try not to be afraid of the weight gain. You can stop whenever you'd like. Most of the weight piled on for me towards the end, long past when I should have stopped, but for experiment's sake I took Matt's advice to the letter. He hasn't worked with many PCOSers, though, and we have special needs. I suspect our needs expand beyond those with just metabolic syndrome, but I'm not sure of the mechanisms of that. Just follow your body.

    I hear you about your weight scars. At my lowest weight, I was always so paranoid that I'd gain it back, as if that number were my main contribution to the world. Gaining weight like this has actually been kinda cathartic to me, knowing that the people who love me still do, and the ones who found me beautiful before haven't suddenly changed their opinions. If you can't bring yourself to that place, however, there's no need to force it.

    So your only remaining symptom is a lack of period? Congratulations! When I was coming off BCP and amenorrheic, it took these two obscenely expensive supplements to bring on a flow: http://www.metagenics.com/products/a...aMeal-Plus-360 and http://www.drwilsons.com/thyro-balance

    The former pushes IR so low as to provoke a flow, while the latter contains iodine and iodide, which can actually dissolve hard masses in the body, including cystic ovaries and a thyroid gland hardened due to low function. I don't take either anymore, but to keep me bleeding I require lots of fat and cholesterol and absolutely no refined sugar, combined with a seaweed supplement (http://www.drrons.com/sea-vegetables...oid-health.htm) for iodine. Now, raising my temperature was the only thing that actually gave me a regular period, as opposed to a continually spotting, irregular one.

    Best of luck on your continued food journey - don't bow to the diet pressure! You're already doing so well.

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    Registered User Alison_o's Avatar
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    What made you stop with the over-feeding - were you happy that your temperature was consistently in a good range?

    It makes sense to me that low temperatures can affect appetite adversely. My temperatures are higher than they were now, but I still don't have a great appetite. When they were at their lowest last year I really wasn't hungry very often at all. I'm going to try a few more tweaks with my diet - adding more animal produce and eating smaller and more often and monitor my temperature - I'll decide what my next steps are based on that.

    It's really good to hear your experiences and encouragement. I send the same well done and support back to you for your own exploration and healing.

    p.s. Have you tried carrots fermented with ginger? They are awesome!
    Alison, Thin Cyster, 36 - diagnosed 1990, no meds since 2007
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