Barbara Nesbitt: “Hi, this is Barbara Nesbitt, and I am at the PCOS Conference in San Diego. I would like Paula Puffer, who is the web-mistress of the PCOS Support website and also the Coordinator of OBGYN.net PCOS Pavilion, to say hello, and she’s going to do an interview.”
Paula Puffer: “Hello, this is kind of a spur of the moment thing so I really don’t have any set questions but I’m sitting here with Walter Futterweit who is with the Mount Sinai School of Medicine in New York City. In some of my work as PCO Support web-master, I’ve had the privilege of putting up Dr. Futterweit’s articles on our bibliography of professional journal articles, and one of the things that I found quite interesting is that he has done research with women who want to become men and PCOS and how the changes with the hormones and stuff have affected them and affected their ovaries.”
Dr. Walter Futterweit: “This is quite a diversion to talk about this subject at this momentous meeting here in San Diego. I must say that a lot of this work is still ongoing, and as a member of the Harry Benjamin Foundation, which is a group of specialists interested in gender patients and the treatment prior to and post-sex reversal surgery, I’ve had occasion to study at least eighty women who were desirous of becoming men. During that time, we found that 27% had features of polycystic ovary prior to treatment with male hormone and after the treatment with testosterone, 75%-80% had enlarged polycystic ovaries which were exactly identical to those found in women with polycystic ovary syndrome. So this is quite a significant percentage and makes us think again of other potential pathological or physiological derangements that may occur not just in terms of altering the mindset of genetic females but what it is that also may be a factor in the causation of PCOS.”
Paula Puffer: “What kind of changes beyond the physiological changes that many of us already know have you seen in transgendered women?”
Dr. Walter Futterweit: “A number of them have significant facial hair, they have the enhanced sensitivity of the hair follicle to a normal or slight increased levels of male hormone, and in some there were irregular periods. So as mentioned, a fair number of them already had polycystic ovary syndrome, that doesn’t mean to say that women with PCOS have a higher tendency to have gender disorders. It just means that in the series of patients that were selected that I have seen, a certain number of them did have PCOS. This in itself is quite exciting because the fact of the matter is that male hormones not only affected the physical development, the mental development, the psych for the psych of the patient but caused presumedly in the rest of the patients features of polycystic ovaries demonstrating for the first time in vivo, in the human that testosterone causes the anatomical changes of polycystic ovary syndrome.”
Paula Puffer: “You mentioned a little bit about mental changes, what kind of changes are those?”
Dr. Walter Futterweit: “An assertiveness, an aggressiveness, not just the male habitus, increased perspiration, thinning hair, change in voice, a swaggering gait, and a more masculine aggressiveness which are associated with features of increased male hormones, and of course increased sexual desire.”
Paula Puffer: “I do a lot of online work with PCOS Support and one of the lists I’m on is directed directly at lesbian and bisexual women. We’ve often talked on that list about how we think differently as far as having PCOS just because we don’t know if it’s the extra testosterone, I hear it so many times that women can multi-task but we also have the analytical capabilities or the more scientific based capabilities. Now whether this is true or not or whether there’s any cognitive way of assessing that has yet to be seen but just as a group, I think women with PCOS, and maybe you’re better qualified to think about this because of the many women you see, but we tend to be a group of over achievers. Would you say that is true?”
Dr. Walter Futterweit: “I think you’re right. I modestly feel that with my experience of close to 1,200 women with PCOS over the last twenty-five years or so most of the women tend to be bright, extremely intelligent, and very motivated. They come from various walks of life but one thing they have in common is a uniformed desire to improve their lot, to enhance their ability to change to something that they would like to see, improved appearance, or the possibility if they wish to achieve fertility and to assume a normal life. In terms of gender changes, I have not been struck by any major difference, that doesn’t mean that a statistical study may not show that. It is something that I think should be looked into, however, more carefully.”
Very interesting, as I have come to the stage in my life where I am happy being who and what I am.
For as long as I can remember from a small child onwards I always felt like a boy, and was a tomboy, the majority of my friends when I was growing up were boys and any female friends I had were also tomboys. I would do things with my dad and one time he turned round and said I think you should have been a boy. Often I would be with him when he was doing stuff to the car etc... My parents had no problems in buying me guns, cars etc.. and didn't force me to wear girly clothes, although on occasions I did much to my horror. I remember after making my First Communion, I couldnt wait to get out of the dress and veil and into my jeans and t-shirt, the other girls loved their white dresses and veils. Whenever I would think about what I wanted to be when I grew up the list was FireMan, Soldier, Engineer, CowBoy etc.. and one time I wanted to be a priest but when I saw myself in these jobs I was a man.
As I grew up I realised I wasn't growing into a man and along with other things I didnt understand I locked it away in my head. I started getting hairy at about 8 or 9 yrs of age and it never bothered me at all. As I was growing up my parents didnt make a big deal out of me being hairy, as far as I was concerned it was normal. At 14 I started to shave as i had a beard growing under my chin and where my sideburns are. In one way I hated this as I had begun to get called names at school yet inside I felt that it was ok. So then I began the daily ritual of shaving, and the time I decided to shave my legs I still got called things at school, I could never win. Also around this age (maybe even before), I realised that I was gay, again this wasn't something I understood much about and being brought up RC it was a no no, so that went into my safe somewhere in my head. Thinking back to my puberty I went through male and female as I got hairier and my voice dropped and I got bigger down below, along with the getting of boobs.
The next 20 yrs I spent trying to fit in with the straight world, and I had my fair share of boyfriends (some of whom I was hairier than, not that they knew as I shaved legs, face chest and tummy).. although they probably did as I get 5 o'clock shadows. I was diagnosed with pcos when I was 18 and that explained the hair growth I had. Over the years the Endo Dr's have tried to treat me with female hormones. Every combination or single dose of them have made me ill, within 2 weeks the Dr's take me off them. My body is very happy when left with its high Testosterone and any of the other male hormones I have. A few Dr's have said that without my increase in male hormone, I would still be hairy from the amount and distribution of it that I had. Last year I finally got the Dr to agree with me that there is no point in trying to give me female hormones which do nothing but make me ill. She agreed and said that if my body was in balance with the hormones I have, then they should leave it alone. I don't want kids, I have spent the majority of my life without periods and do not want them. Although since 2003 I have had problems with bleeding due to polyps which were removed twice, and I have just had a trans cervical resection of endometrium, hopefully this will end that problem. I have tried to get them to do a hysterectomy, but due to angina, diabetes and high BP they dont like putting me under for long.
I came out when I was 34 and over the years I have evolved and let my locked up feelings out as I can cope with them now. I understand that for whatever reason I was born into a female body, well not that female as I have a very masculine build. I know that I should have been male. I grow my beard now and feel at home, I can look in a mirror and see the man I wanted to grow up to be staring back at me, and I like it. I still am clean shaven for hospital appts and when i go into hospital and when I go home to my parents, or in situations where having a beard wouldnt go down too well, but I am content that I can be me and grow my beard. I have worn mens clothes for years as they fit me and suit me better than female clothing, if I want to I can pack and that makes me feel good about myself. I know other TG people and they are fully transitioning, I dont feel the need to transition as I am happy and my partner loves me for being me, as she says she has the best of both of my worlds and I love it too. I dont need to take extra T or have any ops, I have all I need and I dont know if it is just due to the raised T or whether I had started to be male in the womb, as my anatomy down below is not your usual female looking genitalia, and I know pcos ladies some do have a larger clitoris and that no doubt has something to do with it as well.
I wonder if there are any other pcos members who feel the same or are not sure about who they are gender wise. It is very confusing, but thankfully I know who I am now. I apologise if I have rambled here.
__________________ -------------------------------------------
45(feels like 99 some days)
Dx - pcos 1982
Dx - diabetes 2 1999,
Tx - metformin slow release 2000mg. Insulin 5 times a day
Loads of other medications.
------------------------------- What is a friend?A single soul dwelling in two bodies.
Aristotle...
Thank you so much Kat for posting these great articles!
Quote:
Originally Posted by squidge63
I wonder if there are any other pcos members who feel the same or are not sure about who they are gender wise. It is very confusing, but thankfully I know who I am now. I apologise if I have rambled here.
ME!!! I'm just now scratching the surface of this issue at age 32, but I've never felt "right" gender-wise. For me it's super complicated. It is truly as if I am a male to female transexual. I like looking like a woman, but I feel like a man inside. I think like a man (stereotyping here, sorry), relate more to my male friends, enjoy stereotypical "male" persuits, and on and on. Yet if you were to meet me on the street you would see a very feminine woman. Almost comically so. It's so confusing!
I've recently began going to a "gay club" (but there's plenty of straights, too) and this is helping more than therapy with this issue. There is such a great atmosphere there and I've danced with all stripes freely. I enjoy not having to "identify" sexually one way or the other. My sexual orientation and gender just doesn't fit into a neat little box. I'm meeting more and more drag queens and male to female trans and I've decided that they understand me best. I look forward to meeting more folks
Thank you very much for opening up so freely about this Squidge. I really do appreciate it! No one I am close to right now, gay or straight, can understand what the hell I'm talking about with these issues. I'm so glad that you've reached a state of peace about who you are. I see so many people struggle with this
__________________ Me (33)/Michael (3o) Together for almost nine long, happy years!
First PCOS dx: 1989 Supplements: One A Day Weight Smart, B Complex, Biotin, Pantothenic Acid (B5), B12, Saw Palmetto, Vit C, Vit D3, NAC, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Chromium Piconolate, Cinnamon, Magnesium, EPO, Zinc Gluconate, Green Tea Diet: "Modified" Zone plan
"You don't love a woman because she is beautiful, but she is beautiful because you love her" -Anon.
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Thank you so much Kat for posting these great articles!
ME!!! I'm just now scratching the surface of this issue at age 32, but I've never felt "right" gender-wise. For me it's super complicated. It is truly as if I am a male to female transexual. I like looking like a woman, but I feel like a man inside. I think like a man (stereotyping here, sorry), relate more to my male friends, enjoy stereotypical "male" persuits, and on and on. Yet if you were to meet me on the street you would see a very feminine woman. Almost comically so. It's so confusing!
I've recently began going to a "gay club" (but there's plenty of straights, too) and this is helping more than therapy with this issue. There is such a great atmosphere there and I've danced with all stripes freely. I enjoy not having to "identify" sexually one way or the other. My sexual orientation and gender just doesn't fit into a neat little box. I'm meeting more and more drag queens and male to female trans and I've decided that they understand me best. I look forward to meeting more folks
Thank you very much for opening up so freely about this Squidge. I really do appreciate it! No one I am close to right now, gay or straight, can understand what the hell I'm talking about with these issues. I'm so glad that you've reached a state of peace about who you are. I see so many people struggle with this
Began to think I was the only one on soulcysters, not that it matters. It is a very confusing time as you know.. I kept it in the depths of my mind since a kid, it's only now that I am comfortable with me and I will be 42 next month. Luckily my best friend understands me and so does my girlfriend which helps a lot.
Like you I am more comfortable in male company(gay and straight), at work I always got on better with the guys. Any of the tests that you can find online like what sex is your brain etc... I always come out >80% my thinking is more male than female, and even since a baby I have looked male, apart from when I had long hair and mum stuck me in a dress....lol. Also enjoy masculine pursuits as well... As I got older my body became more masculine than feminine, and I bought a "soft packer" the other day so that when I want to feel more like the man I should have been I can wear it. My partner has one that she bought which I wear when I am in the US.
If you ever want to find out more try doing searchs for FTM sites there are plenty out there and very informative and helpful. On the butch-femme site where I am a member there are quite a few TG people and quite a few who have transitioned. Reading their stories I realised that it was ok and I wasnt some oddball, which is when I let the little boy who had been kept under lock and key out of the deep recess of my mind, although he is a full grown man now ....lol Some on there were feminine looking women as well, so you are not alone in that respect either.
I hope you get to a stage where you can feel comfortable, I also know what you mean about not having to be part of any one gender in gay clubs. Last year I had a gay guy eye me up his b'fd saw him and dragged him away, later on that night he caught him eyeing me up again and dragged him out of the club...lol Another time I had a guy in a dress eye me up for 2 hours and he was absolutely distraught when he was told that I wasnt a guy, I was chatting to him and he said 'are you sure you arent a guy'... I am either lurking around here or on butch-femme if you want to ask anything..
Take care
Squidge
__________________ -------------------------------------------
45(feels like 99 some days)
Dx - pcos 1982
Dx - diabetes 2 1999,
Tx - metformin slow release 2000mg. Insulin 5 times a day
Loads of other medications.
------------------------------- What is a friend?A single soul dwelling in two bodies.
Aristotle...
Oh Squidge, you rock! If I weren't poorer than the proverbial churchmouse I would seriously send you a payment as you are TONS more help on this issue than my therapist. Seriously. She's great, but I don't think anyone who hasn't been there can really "get" this sort of thing.
I thought about sending this privately, but then I thought that others out there might be dealing with similar issues and just aren't ready to talk about them yet. I'm all about being honest and open (I'm shameless really!) and if my ramblings help anyone else think about their own issues I'd feel as if it served a purpose.
I appreciate you so openly and frankly sharing your experiences with this. I relate to much of what you say. I've always felt it was a blessing really. I can think "like a man" and understand their perspectives, yet my experiences growing up and living as a girl/woman allow me to also see their perspectives, if not be a bit puzzled by them.
I definitely have a "male brain" though, and male muscle mass and brawn underneath this girly exterior. I did very rough physical work most of my younger years and people couldn't believe the feats I was capable of. My tiny bones conceal just how much muscle I carry, but I could do physical work many men couldn't! I even used to fight with men back in my running with the skinheads (non-racist!) days. Boy did that shock some folks! I appreciated and honored my physical prowess, but I only whipped it out when I had to.
I loved helping my male friends fix their cars. Helping them with their computer science degree homework (I love programming!). I loved being the only girl in my high level science classes at school. I just love science, period!
But then all this is trapped in this girly body. Even worse, I actually LIKE my girly body (to a point). This is where my confusion enters.
By girly body, I mean obscene. I don't do measurements thanks to a little eating disorder problem, but I do know I wear a 36DD bra, have a tiny waist (albeit with a bit of a pooch in front thanks to PCOS), and wide hips. I actually had a woman come up to me in a club and ask me where I had gotten my corset. Imagine my embarrassment when I told her I wasn't wearing one When I go out clubbing I do rather elaborate makeup and I like experimenting with it and different looks. I have thigh-length hair that I style pretty elaborately as well. I wear short skirts, but big clunky shoes (I REFUSE to ruin my feet with heels!). I guess I can see why I get mistaken for a MtF tran or drag queen, when I think about it! Every action I take when I am in "girl mode" is almost comically girly as well. I can't help it, it isn't an affectation, it's just who I am.
Now just imagine that... a "man's brain" mixed with those outer trappings and mannerisms. It's crazy! Luckily I belong to a sub-culture that tends towards androgeny and openness about such things (goth, if you're curious). I love seeing men, straight and gay, in skirts and makeup. I would love to live in a more androgenyous culture where lines were blurred and everyone could feel free to be who they really wanted to be!
I have thought about packing, actually. I'm curious how it would "feel" psychologically. As soon as we have some disposable income I plan on giving it a try, just to see.
I got a kick out of your story about the guy in the dress I get that, too! Men in dresses (I won't assume what they "are", ugh, labels) love me! We seem drawn to each other somehow. I feel most comfortable with them, honestly... which makes sense I suppose, if you think about it. I really AM kind of a man in a skirt! I always go out of my way to compliment them as I respect how difficult it must be just logistically to pull that off. I'm going back to that club tonight and I'm really looking forward to it!
Luckily I have a great, understanding partner as well. He is a bit androgenyous as well and gets mistaken for "gay" all the time. He doesn't mind, as two of his brothers are gay and his sister is bi. He is the only "straight" child in the family. Thankfully he isn't heterosexist at all and very open minded. Like me, he dresses very stereotypically "male", but is very stereotypically "womanly" in the way he thinks. He takes "sensitive male" to a whole 'nother level! The only time it bothers him a bit is when people call him "ma'am" on the phone. Heh!
Ah well, I've rambled enough. Thanks for listening Squidge... you really are a great, wise person! I definitely suspect we are not the only ones out there with PCOS, or even on this board, dealing with these issues. My one and only female friend has PCOS and is very much like you describe yourself. Sadly she is going all girly to please a boyfriend I hope and long for the day that we are all, gay, bi, straight, or other, are allowed to just "be" without guilt or shame. Who decided that people should fit neatly into little boxes anyway?
Thanks again for all your wise help!
__________________ Me (33)/Michael (3o) Together for almost nine long, happy years!
First PCOS dx: 1989 Supplements: One A Day Weight Smart, B Complex, Biotin, Pantothenic Acid (B5), B12, Saw Palmetto, Vit C, Vit D3, NAC, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Chromium Piconolate, Cinnamon, Magnesium, EPO, Zinc Gluconate, Green Tea Diet: "Modified" Zone plan
"You don't love a woman because she is beautiful, but she is beautiful because you love her" -Anon.
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Thanks for posting this. As an out female to male transsexual, this rings very true to my experience. If anyone on soulcysters has any questions about a transgender or transsexual experience, please feel free to contact me at rrroguebear AT gmail.com
Thanks for speaking up Riley! I love your quiff! It reminds me a bit of Morrissey and anything that reminds me of Morrissey makes me happy!
This has been such a liberating experience to finally be able to freely talk about such things without feeling the least bit odd. I thank you all for that, especially Squidge. You've helped me more than you know You're a gem!
And thank you so much for introducing me to butch-femme! I feel as if the blindfold has fallen from my eyes at last Right now I'm just reading and reading and absorbing as much info as I can. It's odd, but I swear my partner and I's relationship is similar... only he doesn't have to pack You'd have to see us in action, it's very hard to explain in words.
Thank you both for being so open and sharing! I bet a lot of other cysters deal with this issue, but aren't ready to talk yet for their own reasons.
Dana
__________________ Me (33)/Michael (3o) Together for almost nine long, happy years!
First PCOS dx: 1989 Supplements: One A Day Weight Smart, B Complex, Biotin, Pantothenic Acid (B5), B12, Saw Palmetto, Vit C, Vit D3, NAC, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Chromium Piconolate, Cinnamon, Magnesium, EPO, Zinc Gluconate, Green Tea Diet: "Modified" Zone plan
"You don't love a woman because she is beautiful, but she is beautiful because you love her" -Anon.
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Riley.. good to see your post, I am sure there will be questions asked about TG info etc...
Abumpygal.. might catch up with you on Butch-Femme sometime when you start posting on there, not that you have to post of course... just realised you will be able to see my gallery pics... lol There is plenty to read on BF and it helped me very much to know that I wasnt the only person feeling the way i did. It is good here too that there are 3 of us who have spoken about how we are.
Look forward to seeing more posts in this section... even if it is from the 3 of us..
__________________ -------------------------------------------
45(feels like 99 some days)
Dx - pcos 1982
Dx - diabetes 2 1999,
Tx - metformin slow release 2000mg. Insulin 5 times a day
Loads of other medications.
------------------------------- What is a friend?A single soul dwelling in two bodies.
Aristotle...
I also go to the gay clubs alot. There is a club here I frequent, and although I Am not transgender, I have noticed that a lot of the transgendered women-to-men at the club look PCOS-ish. Like they have the traits. I have noticed also about half of the women I have been with are too, in fact, PCOS-ers. I do the Rocky Horror Picture Show here, and 3 of us on cast are dealing with PCOS. Our cast manager (Who has PCOS) is going to see a specialist in Delaware over Winter break.( I am hoping that he will tell her something that will be useful to me.)
This interview basically confirmed what I was thinking all along. Were Testosterone Pumped and some of us are proud of our facial fur
__________________
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Me - 28 DH - 33 m. 1998
DX 1996. M/C Oct. 20th, 2008. EDD was June 26th, 2009.
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7/2009 Survived a 70lb tumor caused by PCOS. My Story: To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Very interesting, as I have come to the stage in my life where I am happy being who and what I am.
While I come at this from a very definitely heterosexual point of view, I think that what you've just said there is tremendously important for all of us. If we're not comfortable with ourselves, it's going to be very difficult for other people to be comfortable with us -- or us with others.
Quote:
For as long as I can remember from a small child onwards I always felt like a boy.
Quote:
I started getting hairy at about 8 or 9 yrs of age and it never bothered me at all.
Quote:
At 14 I started to shave as i had a beard growing under my chin and where my sideburns are.
Quote:
Thinking back to my puberty I went through male and female as I got hairier and my voice dropped and I got bigger down below, along with the getting of boobs.
Quote:
I had my fair share of boyfriends (some of whom I was hairier than, not that they knew as I shaved legs, face chest and tummy).. although they probably did as I get 5 o'clock shadows.
Quote:
Over the years the Endo Dr's have tried to treat me with female hormones. Every combination or single dose of them have made me ill, within 2 weeks the Dr's take me off them. My body is very happy when left with its high Testosterone and any of the other male hormones I have.
Quote:
Last year I finally got the Dr to agree with me that there is no point in trying to give me female hormones which do nothing but make me ill. She agreed and said that if my body was in balance with the hormones I have, then they should leave it alone.
Quote:
I dont need to take extra T or have any ops, I have all I need and I dont know if it is just due to the raised T or whether I had started to be male in the womb, as my anatomy down below is not your usual female looking genitalia, and I know pcos ladies some do have a larger clitoris and that no doubt has something to do with it as well.
Quote:
I wonder if there are any other pcos members who feel the same or are not sure about who they are gender wise. It is very confusing, but thankfully I know who I am now. I apologise if I have rambled here.
No, you haven't rambled. And you make a lot of very good points. Many of us could echo what you've said on all or at least most of the points quoted above.
It's a fact that PCOS does make us different from the "average" female and very different from what society would consider the idealized female
It's also a fact that the testosterone levels involved in PCOS can and often do have an effect on our brains and therefore our pattern of thought, in many cases making it more male-like.
It's also a fact that those testosterone levels involved in PCOS also affect our bodies, though to varying extents. Some changes are more common than others.
A change to male-type hair patterns obvioiusly affects most of us to a greater or lesser extent.
A change to an apple shape (male pattern weight distribution) rather than a pear shape (female pattern weight distribution) is common.
Other variations such as the genital ones to which you refer don't occur with everyone who has PCOS, but they're certainly not rare. Indeed changes in genital configuration are very common at menopause even among women without PCOS as estrogen levels drop.
Trying to make ourselves "normal" is not a battle we're going to win. But if we accept ourselves for who and what we are, we can still be contented individuals.
I have a very happy heterosexual relationship with a husband who loves me for what I am.
Abumpygal.. might catch up with you on Butch-Femme sometime when you start posting on there, not that you have to post of course... just realised you will be able to see my gallery pics... lol There is plenty to read on BF and it helped me very much to know that I wasnt the only person feeling the way i did. It is good here too that there are 3 of us who have spoken about how we are.
Squidge... the first night I went there my partner was kind of lurking nervously about in the background. He's a doll, and has been 100% supportive of me since day one (yes, we did actually talk about this stuff on our first date! ha!), but I can tell he gets... nervous I suppose.
When I saw a post by you and got all excited and said, "Look, look! It's Squidge!" I swear he got a weeeee bit jealous for a second! He recovered nicely though, and suggested that I sign up so I can see your album (those avatars are sooo tiny!). I explained that I felt a bit weird about that until I spoke to you about it, as it felt like it was an invasion of your privacy (and it does feel that way to me). He was visibly upset and said, "But he looks good looking! I wanna see! C'mon!"
Told ya we weren't your average "straight" couple! He just came 'packed by nature'!
I'm glad you use the same name on both boards or I would have never known! I guess I would have guessed over time, as you definitely have your own style, but that made things easier.
Right now I am still undecided on whether to post or not. Or even register and lurk. I do know that I am getting a few holiday gifts from their store though! I guess I'm just afraid because of that whole labeling thing... right now I'm "straight" because I'm with a person with male genitalia. When I was 'messing about' with women I was called "bi". I guess I fear not being accepted, and I couldn't blame them at all considering how many "straight" people behave. I just don't know It's hard for anyone who hasn't seen my partner and I in person to understand what I mean when I say we just aren't you're average couple. And how do you explain that in print? How the hell do I explain any of this in print?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squidge63
Look forward to seeing more posts in this section... even if it is from the 3 of us..
Definitely! I've been wanting to post lately but I'm going through a med change that makes it even harder to communicate effectively, and this is a tough subject for me as it is as I'm just figuring things out. I'm glad Riley posted and helped me get over my fear of saying something absurd!
It's good to talk to you Squidge I'll never forget how you helped me!
I know, KNOW there has to be more of us out there! Don't be afraid ladies!
Dana
__________________ Me (33)/Michael (3o) Together for almost nine long, happy years!
First PCOS dx: 1989 Supplements: One A Day Weight Smart, B Complex, Biotin, Pantothenic Acid (B5), B12, Saw Palmetto, Vit C, Vit D3, NAC, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Chromium Piconolate, Cinnamon, Magnesium, EPO, Zinc Gluconate, Green Tea Diet: "Modified" Zone plan
"You don't love a woman because she is beautiful, but she is beautiful because you love her" -Anon.
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Trying to make ourselves "normal" is not a battle we're going to win. But if we accept ourselves for who and what we are, we can still be contented individuals.
I have a very happy heterosexual relationship with a husband who loves me for what I am.
Yup.. acceptance is the word, but it is not always easy to come to.
What is "normal", my view is that it is different for everyone. It doesn't come straight away accepting yourself with all the things pcos throws at you in life, it took me several years to comfortable in my skin because I was fighting the thought of being gay, I practically became homophobic as I was scared somebody would realise I was gay and "out" me.. when I did come out the majority of people I told said " we knew that we were just waiting for you to realise it".... lol
I went down the straight path and did enjoy myself along the way but knew I wasn't really being who I was. Plus I felt I had to conform to the so called "normality" that goes with being a straight woman ( I hated shaving my body hair,), I felt that it was stipping me of my identity, not that I was sure of who I was, as I locked up the gay feelings and the TG feelings that I couldnt understand then.
I spent 10 years single and that made me think more about life, love, pcos being gay etc.... and I began to realise that it was time to be myself which is when I came out, and it was like a weight off my shoulders, and the dark cloud that seemed to lurk overhead lifted. I still worried somewhat about how gay women would treat me with the hair issue, shaving, masculine body etc.... and I got quite a few knock backs in the 8 years that I have been out, not due to the hair, although I did have a group of gay women at a pride party say "oh we are lesbians we dont dance with men"!!!!!! but what amazed me was that 2 of them had hairy legs (grant you not as hairy as mine lol.
It is in the past year and a half that I began to let my trueself out and explore the TG side of me, and again reading that there are plenty of others in the same boat that I have become very comfortable with who I am. Reading the posts on here about the hair issue also put some of my comfortableness into perspective as I see how upset the majority of women are. I know it is hard, unfeminine, etc... and many feel that they will not find someone to love them, or are even worried about their partners, husbands feelings. Your other halves LOVE YOU for being YOU, they wouldnt be with you if they didn't. I know my partner loves me for my masculinity with the feminine (not sure how much is feminine with me mind lol) twist. Talking about pcos to friends, partners etc.. it may seem hard to do but it does help, when I was diagnosed in 82 when my friends asked i told them what was wrong, and have continued to tell people if they ask, it really isnt something to be ashamed about, which I have learned over the years. The other thing I have found on this site... is that all of us whatever shape size excess hair we have, is that we survive, we get through times we dont think we will, there is an awesome support network on here, and we all have something positive to add and hopefully my posts do help other cysters, ok I may be gay and know that I am in the wrong gendered body, but I have pcos like the rest of you and if i can help in anyway all people need to do is ask, I have lived with pcos for almost 24 yrs now.
__________________ -------------------------------------------
45(feels like 99 some days)
Dx - pcos 1982
Dx - diabetes 2 1999,
Tx - metformin slow release 2000mg. Insulin 5 times a day
Loads of other medications.
------------------------------- What is a friend?A single soul dwelling in two bodies.
Aristotle...
I also go to the gay clubs alot. There is a club here I frequent, and although I Am not transgender, I have noticed that a lot of the transgendered women-to-men at the club look PCOS-ish. Like they have the traits.
Sadly I don't see too many truly transgendered women in my neck of the woods. Either that or they or THAT good!! Last one I remember seeing was in 1997 and yes, she did look rather PCOS-ish now that you mention it, especially in body shape. We do have plenty of butches though and I swear an easy 90% of them have PCOS... one can just 'tell' ya know? Heck, even most just plain ol'goth girls tend towards the PCOS side if you think about it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gothic_Kitten_1981
I have noticed also about half of the women I have been with are too, in fact, PCOS-ers.
Ok, it's secret telling time I've always been attracted to women in the abstract sexually, there was just maybe only one or possibly two I could imagine having a real relationship with instead of just your usual messing about. Those two women? Dx'd PCOS. Imagine that!
Then I was hugged by a very, very fluffy PCOS gal. I don't know FOR SURE that she has it, but come on... she has every sign, even the face shape! When that woman hugged me something went off in my brain. I literally swooned! I can't remember ever swooning like that for a man. So now I have a crush... but I think I'd die of embarrassment if she found out! Not out of fear of rejection or anything silly like that, our scene is just too small and incestuous, if you get my drift (sigh). Forget "Six Degrees of Seperation" at best here we have "Two Degrees of Seperation". I'd do anything to hug her again, though
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gothic_Kitten_1981
I do the Rocky Horror Picture Show here, and 3 of us on cast are dealing with PCOS. Our cast manager (Who has PCOS) is going to see a specialist in Delaware over Winter break.( I am hoping that he will tell her something that will be useful to me.)
Wow, that's one heck of a coincidence! Would you mind PMing me the name of the specialist she is seeing, as Delaware is not far away at all from here and I'd do anything at this point! I hope she comes back with some answers for you all... this syndrome can be so, frustrating is the kind word for it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gothic_Kitten_1981
This interview basically confirmed what I was thinking all along. Were Testosterone Pumped and some of us are proud of our facial fur
You know, I was just thinking of this today. I'm doing a lot of natural remedies for PCOS and I think some of them are working. Sadly, one of the most disabling diseases I have at the mo (Hidradenitis Suppurativa) is androgen dependent and thus I have to lower my androgens and thus testosterone. I've been feeling... different lately and I'm not sure I like it. I wish there was a way I could keep my testosterone and not get the bumps! I don't even mind shaving every day, I really don't!! And yet I'm so girly and femme... I'm an enigma really.
Thanks for sharing hon! (((hugs)))
Dana
__________________ Me (33)/Michael (3o) Together for almost nine long, happy years!
First PCOS dx: 1989 Supplements: One A Day Weight Smart, B Complex, Biotin, Pantothenic Acid (B5), B12, Saw Palmetto, Vit C, Vit D3, NAC, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Chromium Piconolate, Cinnamon, Magnesium, EPO, Zinc Gluconate, Green Tea Diet: "Modified" Zone plan
"You don't love a woman because she is beautiful, but she is beautiful because you love her" -Anon.
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While I come at this from a very definitely heterosexual point of view, I think that what you've just said there is tremendously important for all of us. If we're not comfortable with ourselves, it's going to be very difficult for other people to be comfortable with us -- or us with others.
BRAVO!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joyblack
Trying to make ourselves "normal" is not a battle we're going to win. But if we accept ourselves for who and what we are, we can still be contented individuals.
Indeed! This would be an excellent thing to print out and put on every mirror in the house (discreetly, yet not). We are who we are and yes, some venting of frustrations on occasion is human, but we're just going to have to make peace with ourselves in the end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joyblack
I have a very happy heterosexual relationship with a husband who loves me for what I am.
I'm glad you have someone who loves the true you and that you are happy
Thanks for writing!
Dana
__________________ Me (33)/Michael (3o) Together for almost nine long, happy years!
First PCOS dx: 1989 Supplements: One A Day Weight Smart, B Complex, Biotin, Pantothenic Acid (B5), B12, Saw Palmetto, Vit C, Vit D3, NAC, Alpha Lipoic Acid, Chromium Piconolate, Cinnamon, Magnesium, EPO, Zinc Gluconate, Green Tea Diet: "Modified" Zone plan
"You don't love a woman because she is beautiful, but she is beautiful because you love her" -Anon.
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Transgender / PCOS 
When I go out clubbing I do rather elaborate makeup and I like experimenting with it and different looks. I have thigh-length hair that I style pretty elaborately as well. I wear short skirts, but big clunky shoes (I REFUSE to ruin my feet with heels!). I guess I can see why I get mistaken for a MtF tran or drag queen, when I think about it! Every action I take when I am in "girl mode" is almost comically girly as well. I can't help it, it isn't an affectation, it's just who I am.
I get that, too! Men in dresses (I won't assume what they "are", ugh, labels) love me! We seem drawn to each other somehow. I feel most comfortable with them, honestly... which makes sense I suppose, if you think about it. I really AM kind of a man in a skirt! I always go out of my way to compliment them as I respect how difficult it must be just logistically to pull that off. I'm going back to that club tonight and I'm really looking forward to it!
You're a gem!
Right now I'm just reading and reading and absorbing as much info as I can. It's odd, but I swear my partner and I's relationship is similar... only he doesn't have to pack 
You'd have to see us in action, it's very hard to explain in words.
BRAVO!!!!!
